1 00:00:08,513 --> 00:00:10,596 Inspiration. 2 00:00:14,402 --> 00:00:16,986 Community. 3 00:00:20,408 --> 00:00:22,275 Industry. 4 00:00:25,113 --> 00:00:27,446 Gentrification. 5 00:00:31,703 --> 00:00:33,586 Creativity. 6 00:00:37,258 --> 00:00:39,125 Survival. 7 00:00:41,713 --> 00:00:43,179 Starting over. 8 00:00:48,019 --> 00:00:49,769 We've travelled all across the country 9 00:00:49,804 --> 00:00:53,139 and we've been inspired at every stop along the way. 10 00:00:54,976 --> 00:00:58,844 Now there's really only one place left to go. 11 00:01:54,764 --> 00:01:58,310 Sync, corrected by icephoenix www.addic7ed.com 12 00:02:03,418 --> 00:02:09,908 _ 13 00:02:15,940 --> 00:02:18,307 These people and their stories, 14 00:02:18,359 --> 00:02:21,193 these cities and their history, 15 00:02:21,229 --> 00:02:24,280 the culture, the accent, 16 00:02:24,315 --> 00:02:27,366 the geography, the music... 17 00:02:27,402 --> 00:02:31,287 These interviews have all been more like lessons. 18 00:02:31,322 --> 00:02:34,156 And it's all led us here 19 00:02:34,208 --> 00:02:36,242 to the greatest city in America. 20 00:02:43,050 --> 00:02:46,085 I love New York. When I want the insanity 21 00:02:46,137 --> 00:02:48,971 and the energy of the city, I'm here. 22 00:02:52,727 --> 00:02:56,061 The city is just alive. It literally is 24/7. 23 00:02:57,732 --> 00:03:00,266 Just action all the time. 24 00:03:02,603 --> 00:03:04,570 It is this confluence of cultures 25 00:03:04,605 --> 00:03:06,689 from all over the world 26 00:03:06,741 --> 00:03:09,942 and you literally get it walking down the street. 27 00:03:11,579 --> 00:03:14,163 The whole thing of living in close proximity 28 00:03:14,198 --> 00:03:17,333 not only to people that are different, but to strangers, 29 00:03:17,368 --> 00:03:19,001 to people you don't know at all. 30 00:03:21,038 --> 00:03:23,756 You take the subway when you're five years old. 31 00:03:23,791 --> 00:03:27,259 You figure it out really fast. 32 00:03:27,295 --> 00:03:31,297 And it's a little mini world, New York. 33 00:03:31,299 --> 00:03:34,016 When you grow up in New York, you kind of get that walk. 34 00:03:34,051 --> 00:03:35,434 You know, I know what I'm doing, 35 00:03:35,470 --> 00:03:37,186 I know where I'm going, and don't mess with me. 36 00:03:37,221 --> 00:03:40,639 I'm walking here! I'm walking here! 37 00:03:42,193 --> 00:03:44,393 With New York, it's like everything has to come 38 00:03:44,445 --> 00:03:46,812 with its own personal legend, it's own personal myth. 39 00:03:46,864 --> 00:03:49,198 Live... from New York... it's Saturday night! 40 00:03:49,233 --> 00:03:51,984 But that's why they say if you can make it there, you can make it anywhere. 41 00:04:17,261 --> 00:04:20,479 First place I lived in New York, it was $105 a month. 42 00:04:21,682 --> 00:04:24,183 You could live in New York in the '70s 43 00:04:24,185 --> 00:04:27,119 on no money because the city was really destitute. 44 00:04:27,154 --> 00:04:29,722 And, yeah, I would run home every night, 45 00:04:29,757 --> 00:04:31,941 but it was $105 a month. 46 00:04:33,861 --> 00:04:36,028 I always remember hanging out 47 00:04:36,080 --> 00:04:40,032 with the 75-year-old doorman where I worked 48 00:04:40,034 --> 00:04:41,867 and I was just like, "Man, I really love this city, man. 49 00:04:41,869 --> 00:04:45,087 Tonight I'm gonna go and see The Dead Boys 50 00:04:45,122 --> 00:04:48,173 and Patti Smith Group, Television, and Talking Heads." 51 00:04:48,209 --> 00:04:51,210 And he's like, "No, this city is a shadow 52 00:04:51,262 --> 00:04:53,796 of what it used to be in the '40s." 53 00:05:05,192 --> 00:05:06,609 And I looked at his face and was like, 54 00:05:06,644 --> 00:05:08,694 "Really? It's gone for you? 55 00:05:08,729 --> 00:05:10,479 Because it's killer for me right now." 56 00:05:23,661 --> 00:05:25,628 There was no mediocrity in the city. 57 00:05:25,663 --> 00:05:27,296 There never was mediocrity in New York. 58 00:05:37,475 --> 00:05:39,592 To me, Paul Simon is New York. 59 00:05:39,644 --> 00:05:41,927 He loves that city 60 00:05:41,929 --> 00:05:44,563 and people that live there tend to write about it. 61 00:06:08,756 --> 00:06:10,539 You're gonna be exposed to everything. 62 00:06:10,591 --> 00:06:12,758 There's no way that you're just gonna be in New York 63 00:06:12,793 --> 00:06:14,510 and only be aware of one kind of music. 64 00:06:14,545 --> 00:06:17,179 You may prefer one type of music and have your favorites, 65 00:06:17,214 --> 00:06:20,349 but you're gonna be familiar with all kinds of stuff. 66 00:06:25,239 --> 00:06:27,806 And also, New York radio was very powerful. 67 00:06:29,360 --> 00:06:30,726 You're listening to the Spinners, 68 00:06:30,778 --> 00:06:32,811 but then also you're getting into Steely Dan. 69 00:06:32,863 --> 00:06:35,481 You're getting a little bit of Gladys Knight and the Pips, 70 00:06:35,533 --> 00:06:37,866 but you're also getting "Band On the Run." 71 00:06:40,204 --> 00:06:43,038 Even at the creative level, the making of music 72 00:06:43,074 --> 00:06:45,290 in this city is a business. It always was. 73 00:06:45,326 --> 00:06:46,659 In Tin Pan Alley, 74 00:06:46,711 --> 00:06:50,629 legendary home of Broadway's tune splishers and composers, 75 00:06:50,665 --> 00:06:52,665 the nation's popular songs are created. 76 00:06:52,717 --> 00:06:55,584 The original song factory would be Tin Pan Alley. 77 00:06:55,636 --> 00:06:58,170 There was the Gershwins, Irving Berlin. 78 00:06:58,222 --> 00:07:01,640 People wrote songs to be popular. 79 00:07:07,515 --> 00:07:10,099 You know, you bought the sheet music. 80 00:07:10,151 --> 00:07:12,101 Sheet music was the first records. 81 00:07:16,462 --> 00:07:19,024 When they created the music industry, 82 00:07:19,026 --> 00:07:22,361 they created it from a completely different place. 83 00:07:22,413 --> 00:07:26,081 Why did John Hammond record Billie Holiday? 84 00:07:26,117 --> 00:07:27,783 To sell records? 85 00:07:27,835 --> 00:07:30,202 'Cause he ached when he heard her voice. 86 00:07:39,847 --> 00:07:40,879 When they recorded Woody... 87 00:07:46,137 --> 00:07:47,519 It was like hearing Whitman. 88 00:07:47,555 --> 00:07:49,605 It was like hearing the truth. 89 00:07:49,640 --> 00:07:53,299 It dealt with their lives and what they had gone through. 90 00:07:53,322 --> 00:07:55,611 So the industry was created 91 00:07:55,646 --> 00:07:58,397 because they thought this music was important. 92 00:08:00,951 --> 00:08:02,985 The Brill Building scene. 93 00:08:03,037 --> 00:08:05,404 Can you explain what that is? 94 00:08:05,406 --> 00:08:07,990 The Brill Building by the '50s, 95 00:08:08,042 --> 00:08:09,792 early '60s, mid '60s, 96 00:08:09,827 --> 00:08:13,128 was the central and emotional 97 00:08:13,164 --> 00:08:15,164 location for American pop music. 98 00:08:15,216 --> 00:08:16,582 It's where the songwriters were. 99 00:08:39,573 --> 00:08:41,857 Every floor had little offices 100 00:08:41,909 --> 00:08:44,777 with a piano in it and a basic tape recorder. 101 00:08:44,779 --> 00:08:47,112 The publishers were based in that building. 102 00:08:47,114 --> 00:08:49,248 And you came to work and you wrote a song. 103 00:08:49,283 --> 00:08:52,117 Just day after day after day. 104 00:08:54,922 --> 00:08:57,172 The industry was centered here. 105 00:08:57,208 --> 00:09:01,260 No disrespect to LA, but in many ways this was the center of it. 106 00:09:03,881 --> 00:09:06,632 There is something about New York. 107 00:09:06,634 --> 00:09:09,802 Everywhere you go has that intensity. 108 00:09:09,804 --> 00:09:13,689 You go to a nightclub, go to a hamburger shop, 109 00:09:13,724 --> 00:09:18,527 it's all hitting, bouncing off of people. 110 00:09:18,562 --> 00:09:22,364 Then you go to the studio and there's five bands in the studio. 111 00:09:29,657 --> 00:09:32,825 The mid '70s for recording in this town was incredible. 112 00:09:32,827 --> 00:09:37,412 The places that made these time capsules, 113 00:09:37,464 --> 00:09:41,500 these documents of the music that shook the world, 114 00:09:41,502 --> 00:09:45,170 and to go into these bunkers was just the coolest thing. 115 00:09:48,142 --> 00:09:49,474 And there there was the Record Plant. 116 00:09:49,510 --> 00:09:53,011 There was a young assistant engineer 117 00:09:53,047 --> 00:09:54,646 they called Jimmy Shoes. 118 00:09:56,183 --> 00:09:59,985 In studios in those days, they'd wear suits. 119 00:10:00,020 --> 00:10:02,187 I cared about how the Stones were dressing. 120 00:10:02,239 --> 00:10:05,607 You know, Mick Jagger's got snakeskin shoes. 121 00:10:05,659 --> 00:10:08,360 I'd take all my money and buy them. 122 00:10:08,362 --> 00:10:10,946 And so people started messing with me. 123 00:10:10,998 --> 00:10:15,000 Jimmy Shoes grew up to be Jimmy lovine, 124 00:10:15,035 --> 00:10:18,453 arguably the most powerful guy in the music business. 125 00:10:19,707 --> 00:10:21,957 Record Plant was ground zero. 126 00:10:22,009 --> 00:10:25,844 David Bowie's doing "Young Americans" downstairs. 127 00:10:25,880 --> 00:10:29,214 I'm working with John Lennon and Roy Cicala upstairs. 128 00:10:29,266 --> 00:10:32,551 So you feel that. And when you walk by the rooms, you hear KISS. 129 00:10:39,944 --> 00:10:42,311 And when you consider the people that are doing it... 130 00:10:42,363 --> 00:10:46,031 Jimmy lovine working on John Lennon's "Whatever Gets You Thru the Night." 131 00:10:48,302 --> 00:10:51,520 And he tells Jimmy, "By the way, Elton John's coming by to play piano." 132 00:10:51,555 --> 00:10:53,138 And it's like, "Hello!" 133 00:10:53,140 --> 00:10:55,641 You know, this is just an average day at work? 134 00:10:55,676 --> 00:10:57,709 Well, in New York, it is. 135 00:11:00,164 --> 00:11:01,964 I just remember the first time I was walking 136 00:11:01,999 --> 00:11:04,716 past the old belly in front of Electric Lady. 137 00:11:04,752 --> 00:11:08,470 You know, that brick facade that stuck out like a pregnant woman. 138 00:11:08,505 --> 00:11:10,839 I went, "There it is." 139 00:11:10,891 --> 00:11:13,976 Electric Lady Studios, Jimi Hendrix built. 140 00:11:14,011 --> 00:11:17,262 Which was, you know, almost like Jesus coming down 141 00:11:17,314 --> 00:11:18,981 and sanctifying the ground. 142 00:11:21,101 --> 00:11:24,019 That place was running 24 hours a day, seven days a week. 143 00:11:24,071 --> 00:11:26,355 You could have Zeppelin in studio A, 144 00:11:26,407 --> 00:11:29,908 Jeff Beck and Stevie Wonder in studio B. 145 00:11:29,944 --> 00:11:31,827 We did some stuff with Arcade Fire at Electric Lady 146 00:11:31,862 --> 00:11:33,912 and recorded Bowie there, which was sort of crazy 147 00:11:33,948 --> 00:11:36,782 'cause he's like, "Well, downstairs is where we did 'Fame.'" 148 00:11:36,834 --> 00:11:39,534 Like, I wish I could say something like that. 149 00:11:41,288 --> 00:11:45,090 Him just being like, "Huh, almost forgot." 150 00:11:45,125 --> 00:11:46,875 Made "Fame" downstairs. 151 00:11:46,927 --> 00:11:50,796 That studio was on the site of a club 152 00:11:50,798 --> 00:11:52,297 that was originally called Salvation. 153 00:11:52,349 --> 00:11:55,767 That was where Jimi jammed in and played in. 154 00:11:55,803 --> 00:11:58,687 It's funny because Electric Lady is, in fact, the basement. 155 00:11:58,722 --> 00:12:00,389 There was water running through it. 156 00:12:00,441 --> 00:12:02,474 And that had to be dealt with 157 00:12:02,476 --> 00:12:05,477 'cause there were these underground rivers 158 00:12:05,479 --> 00:12:06,945 with, like, super rats. 159 00:12:06,981 --> 00:12:10,148 One thing we know how to raise in New York, rats. 160 00:12:10,200 --> 00:12:12,401 You can ride these things. 161 00:12:12,453 --> 00:12:14,903 They were, I guess, drilling or doing whatever 162 00:12:14,955 --> 00:12:16,488 and they hit an underground river. 163 00:12:16,490 --> 00:12:19,574 Who expected there was going to be a river running 164 00:12:19,626 --> 00:12:22,911 somewhere under West 8th Street in Lower Manhattan? 165 00:12:24,465 --> 00:12:27,666 Here is this prehistoric thing 166 00:12:27,668 --> 00:12:30,502 going on where this guy wants to create music 167 00:12:30,504 --> 00:12:34,589 that's both ancient and to the future. 168 00:12:34,641 --> 00:12:37,843 All of it happening in this one little spot 169 00:12:37,845 --> 00:12:40,762 where most people would walk by and think, 170 00:12:40,814 --> 00:12:43,682 "I've got to get up the street and buy my Daily News." 171 00:12:49,940 --> 00:12:52,157 I considered a lot of studios in New York City, 172 00:12:52,192 --> 00:12:55,027 but rather than use an iconic studio 173 00:12:55,029 --> 00:12:57,112 that most people know about, 174 00:12:57,164 --> 00:13:00,949 I found this tiny place in Soho. 175 00:13:01,001 --> 00:13:02,784 Hi, Dave. Welcome to the Magic Shop. 176 00:13:05,255 --> 00:13:07,255 I really like the name. 177 00:13:07,291 --> 00:13:09,174 I just thought that was such a good name for a studio. 178 00:13:09,209 --> 00:13:10,625 The Magic Shop. 179 00:13:11,879 --> 00:13:14,379 Do you remember much about Steve? 180 00:13:14,381 --> 00:13:16,381 Is he still alive? 181 00:13:16,383 --> 00:13:18,884 - He's still alive. - Okay, good. Just wanted to check. 182 00:13:18,936 --> 00:13:21,686 Come on in and I'll show you the live room. 183 00:13:21,722 --> 00:13:23,522 So much about a studio is the atmosphere 184 00:13:23,557 --> 00:13:25,474 that it's given by its boss. 185 00:13:25,526 --> 00:13:28,810 Whereas Steve, you know, you can just feel the music coming out of him. 186 00:13:28,862 --> 00:13:30,062 He just breathes it. 187 00:13:30,114 --> 00:13:32,230 Then there's all these vintage keyboards 188 00:13:32,282 --> 00:13:34,116 which I've been collecting over the years. 189 00:13:34,151 --> 00:13:35,450 Like a Zombies Wurly. 190 00:13:35,486 --> 00:13:37,069 Right? A tack piano. 191 00:13:37,121 --> 00:13:39,538 This is a Baldwin grand piano. 192 00:13:39,573 --> 00:13:42,124 And Steve is a New Yorker. 193 00:13:42,159 --> 00:13:44,576 He can relate and talk and work with anybody. 194 00:13:44,628 --> 00:13:47,045 This was a guy you knew you could trust. 195 00:13:47,081 --> 00:13:49,381 And whoever you are, however you dress, 196 00:13:49,416 --> 00:13:51,800 whatever you do, it can happen. 197 00:13:51,835 --> 00:13:55,137 And that's basically it. 198 00:13:55,172 --> 00:13:58,757 Well, we picked the Magic Shop because it doesn't look like anything. 199 00:13:58,809 --> 00:14:02,594 Every day for three months, I walked past it. 200 00:14:02,596 --> 00:14:05,097 I still don't know where the door is. 201 00:14:05,149 --> 00:14:08,266 It's like Narnia in that respect. 202 00:14:08,318 --> 00:14:11,019 You have to really try hard to access it. 203 00:14:37,798 --> 00:14:39,381 Do you know the story about the record 204 00:14:39,433 --> 00:14:41,299 at the Magic Shop that David Bowie made? 205 00:14:41,351 --> 00:14:43,802 The one that he made in secret? 206 00:14:43,854 --> 00:14:48,356 The most New York thing about the David Bowie record 207 00:14:48,392 --> 00:14:51,359 "The Next Day" is that he made it in New York 208 00:14:51,395 --> 00:14:53,478 and nobody knew a goddamn thing about it. 209 00:14:53,530 --> 00:14:56,314 He was spotted many times walking down the street. 210 00:14:56,366 --> 00:14:58,483 All the signs were there, but nobody figured out 211 00:14:58,485 --> 00:15:02,120 that we were making the new David Bowie album. That was incredible. 212 00:15:02,156 --> 00:15:05,490 One of the most iconic people can just be like, 213 00:15:05,492 --> 00:15:07,159 "And now I'm wearing this hat 214 00:15:07,161 --> 00:15:09,127 and no one's going to notice." 215 00:15:09,163 --> 00:15:10,579 Like, I think it's pretty slick. 216 00:15:12,049 --> 00:15:14,583 Also, for me, I would probably walk by him and not know him 217 00:15:14,635 --> 00:15:17,802 because I would expect him to be gliding by on, like, a spaceship. 218 00:15:17,838 --> 00:15:20,222 The thing that's really interesting about New York 219 00:15:20,257 --> 00:15:21,806 is it's one of the most public cities 220 00:15:21,842 --> 00:15:23,508 in the world and it's one of the most private. 221 00:15:23,510 --> 00:15:26,428 You can do some of your best work 222 00:15:26,480 --> 00:15:29,181 and do it totally under the radar. 223 00:15:29,183 --> 00:15:31,566 And then when it comes out, it's like, 224 00:15:31,602 --> 00:15:33,435 "Wow, where did it come from?" 225 00:15:33,487 --> 00:15:35,654 And I'm thinking, "Well, it came from New York." 226 00:15:38,025 --> 00:15:41,076 Around 1986 or so, 227 00:15:41,111 --> 00:15:43,862 started toying with the idea of building a studio. 228 00:15:43,864 --> 00:15:46,198 So what was this neighborhood like then? 229 00:15:46,200 --> 00:15:48,416 Oh, man, this was an awful neighborhood. 230 00:15:48,452 --> 00:15:51,253 So now, of course, it's Bloomingdale's 231 00:15:51,288 --> 00:15:53,255 and Michael Kors and all that. 232 00:15:53,290 --> 00:15:55,123 But then, it was really funky. 233 00:15:55,175 --> 00:15:56,625 I would walk down the street 234 00:15:56,677 --> 00:15:59,344 and every day there was broken glass 235 00:15:59,379 --> 00:16:00,795 in front of the cars. 236 00:16:00,847 --> 00:16:03,014 Why the fuck did you pick this place? 237 00:16:03,050 --> 00:16:04,432 Here's why I picked it. 238 00:16:04,468 --> 00:16:06,218 I wanted to have a great drum room. 239 00:16:06,220 --> 00:16:08,687 And when you when in there and you whacked a snare drum, 240 00:16:08,722 --> 00:16:11,223 it really sounded good. 241 00:16:14,027 --> 00:16:17,195 This room sounds fucking sick. 242 00:16:18,482 --> 00:16:21,733 Certain studios just have a magical something. 243 00:16:25,539 --> 00:16:27,405 I don't think it comes down to the design. 244 00:16:27,457 --> 00:16:30,208 Either it has it or it doesn't. 245 00:16:30,244 --> 00:16:32,410 That's cool right there. 246 00:16:34,248 --> 00:16:37,549 There's no way to control it. 247 00:16:42,422 --> 00:16:44,806 - Hey, I have a question. - Oh, yeah. 248 00:16:44,841 --> 00:16:47,592 Butch, where does this come up? 249 00:16:47,644 --> 00:16:49,094 - Do you know? - Good question. 250 00:16:49,096 --> 00:16:51,513 - Your talkback? - Oh, my God! 251 00:16:51,565 --> 00:16:54,899 Oh, shit. Holy shit. 252 00:16:54,935 --> 00:16:57,102 Fuckin' A. 253 00:16:57,154 --> 00:16:59,271 The talkback! 254 00:16:59,273 --> 00:17:02,941 Hey, Butch! I have a question! 255 00:17:02,993 --> 00:17:06,278 When does this mike come up?! 256 00:17:06,280 --> 00:17:08,330 I have a history with The Magic Shop. 257 00:17:08,365 --> 00:17:11,116 I recorded Sonic Youth's "Dirty" there. 258 00:17:11,118 --> 00:17:12,917 It's an amazing sounding room 259 00:17:12,953 --> 00:17:16,087 and I love that they have that old Neve console. 260 00:17:16,123 --> 00:17:18,173 When I walked in the doors with the Foo Fighters, 261 00:17:18,208 --> 00:17:20,342 the studio looked exactly the same 262 00:17:20,377 --> 00:17:22,677 as when I'd been there 20 years ago. 263 00:17:22,713 --> 00:17:25,297 All right, so here are some session reports 264 00:17:25,349 --> 00:17:29,301 for people that were here. So here's The Dictators. 265 00:17:29,353 --> 00:17:31,720 Lou Reed's records. Suzanne Vega. 266 00:17:31,772 --> 00:17:33,938 The session reports for The Ramones. 267 00:17:38,979 --> 00:17:40,945 Here's Patty Smyth. 268 00:17:40,981 --> 00:17:43,815 - Not Patti Smith, but Patty Smyth. - Yeah. 269 00:17:43,867 --> 00:17:45,567 She didn't like me very much. 270 00:17:45,619 --> 00:17:47,952 - Warren Zevon. - Steve, this looks like fifth grade homework. 271 00:17:47,988 --> 00:17:50,322 - I know. So here is... - Oh, wow. 272 00:17:50,324 --> 00:17:51,823 What it looked like when it was opened 273 00:17:51,825 --> 00:17:54,659 with those red risers that I was telling you about. 274 00:17:54,711 --> 00:17:56,494 That's the same carpet, huh? 275 00:17:56,496 --> 00:17:59,130 Yeah, man. I haven't changed my carpet. 276 00:17:59,166 --> 00:18:00,465 - It's really awful. - I can tell. 277 00:18:00,500 --> 00:18:02,717 It's really disgusting, I know. 278 00:18:02,753 --> 00:18:05,053 I get people complaining about it all the time. 279 00:18:05,088 --> 00:18:08,390 And this is a really nice letter 280 00:18:08,425 --> 00:18:10,675 that Rupert wrote to the studio. 281 00:18:10,677 --> 00:18:13,645 I guess I could... I don't want to read it, 282 00:18:13,680 --> 00:18:14,896 but you can see it now. 283 00:18:14,931 --> 00:18:17,098 "Thank you for taking care of my console 284 00:18:17,150 --> 00:18:19,317 and thank you again for your hospitality. 285 00:18:19,353 --> 00:18:22,487 My very best wishes for the future." 286 00:18:22,522 --> 00:18:27,575 You should do something about the carpet. 287 00:18:33,250 --> 00:18:35,700 Things started to change around here... 288 00:18:35,752 --> 00:18:39,537 I think it was maybe '97 or '98 maybe. 289 00:18:39,539 --> 00:18:42,841 Over the holidays, MTV stopped playing rock music 290 00:18:42,876 --> 00:18:45,960 and all of a sudden started playing, 291 00:18:46,012 --> 00:18:49,848 like, what was Justin Timberlake's boy band? 292 00:18:49,883 --> 00:18:52,217 - NSYNC. - NSYNC. 293 00:18:53,603 --> 00:18:56,438 That really impacted the studio pretty seriously. 294 00:18:56,473 --> 00:18:59,724 And the budgets dried up and so the bands dried up. 295 00:19:01,978 --> 00:19:04,529 It was at that point that I moved the studio 296 00:19:04,564 --> 00:19:06,064 in a different direction. 297 00:19:06,116 --> 00:19:08,616 Come on down. 298 00:19:08,652 --> 00:19:10,402 Upstairs we do new records 299 00:19:10,454 --> 00:19:12,871 and then down here is where we do all the audio restoration 300 00:19:12,906 --> 00:19:14,956 and preservation work like Sam Cooke. 301 00:19:35,979 --> 00:19:38,263 My dad had Huntington's disease 302 00:19:38,315 --> 00:19:40,849 for most of my life. 303 00:19:40,901 --> 00:19:44,152 Huntington's changes the way you walk, the way you talk. 304 00:19:44,187 --> 00:19:46,938 After a few years, he couldn't play guitar, 305 00:19:46,990 --> 00:19:48,656 he couldn't sing. 306 00:19:48,692 --> 00:19:50,742 He'd always talk with a slur. 307 00:19:50,777 --> 00:19:54,279 He looked like a drunk. 308 00:19:54,331 --> 00:19:56,614 That's the effect of the disease. 309 00:19:56,616 --> 00:19:59,584 It was really tough as a kid to walk down the street 310 00:19:59,619 --> 00:20:01,586 with people looking at you saying, 311 00:20:01,621 --> 00:20:04,038 "Oh, look at that drunk walking with his kids." 312 00:20:04,090 --> 00:20:08,259 And then years later, here comes this guy Steve 313 00:20:08,295 --> 00:20:11,429 and he plays me this little clip that he had worked on 314 00:20:11,465 --> 00:20:13,631 of my dad talking and singing. 315 00:20:17,354 --> 00:20:20,722 And I just went, "Wow!" 316 00:20:21,975 --> 00:20:24,309 And he was healthy and he was adorable 317 00:20:24,361 --> 00:20:26,945 and he was powerful and he was right. 318 00:20:33,787 --> 00:20:37,155 It opened a door to me to want to know more 319 00:20:37,207 --> 00:20:40,575 about who the young guy was, who the healthy guy was. 320 00:20:44,331 --> 00:20:45,663 Doing restoration work 321 00:20:45,665 --> 00:20:47,332 had a really positive impact 322 00:20:47,384 --> 00:20:50,335 on keeping The Magic Shop going during those years 323 00:20:50,337 --> 00:20:52,504 where people didn't play as much. 324 00:20:52,556 --> 00:20:54,222 Everybody in New York City at that point 325 00:20:54,257 --> 00:20:56,724 hated singer-songwriters, hated Americana music. 326 00:20:56,760 --> 00:20:58,510 Didn't want to hear any of that stuff. 327 00:20:58,512 --> 00:21:00,562 That's the kind of music that we really loved 328 00:21:00,597 --> 00:21:03,481 and we, you know, cultivated. 329 00:21:03,517 --> 00:21:05,934 Every generation has to reinvent itself 330 00:21:05,986 --> 00:21:07,685 musically on every level. 331 00:21:07,687 --> 00:21:09,654 And none of us exist in a vacuum, 332 00:21:09,689 --> 00:21:12,941 so we are influenced and we actually copy. 333 00:21:12,993 --> 00:21:16,694 I mean, Dylan would be the first to tell you that he copied Woody Guthrie. 334 00:21:16,746 --> 00:21:19,831 But look what he did. 335 00:21:24,538 --> 00:21:28,373 Dylan came to our house in 1961 336 00:21:28,425 --> 00:21:32,544 and he was interested in Woody. 337 00:21:32,596 --> 00:21:34,929 And I was watching American Bandstand 338 00:21:34,965 --> 00:21:36,764 and he knocked at the door 339 00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:39,884 and I was so upset because they were teaching the Locomotion. 340 00:21:42,689 --> 00:21:45,356 But he was very insistent. I closed the door twice. 341 00:21:45,392 --> 00:21:47,392 Woody Guthrie is not here. Good-bye. 342 00:21:47,444 --> 00:21:51,563 Finally Arlo came to the door, saw that he had a guitar. 343 00:21:51,615 --> 00:21:54,732 If Arlo hadn't answered the door the third time, 344 00:21:54,784 --> 00:21:56,985 music history would be really different. 345 00:22:04,327 --> 00:22:07,245 The Village was alive. 346 00:22:07,297 --> 00:22:09,664 Lots of places to play. 347 00:22:09,716 --> 00:22:11,082 And everybody was down there. 348 00:22:14,087 --> 00:22:16,671 Those were the formative years 349 00:22:16,723 --> 00:22:20,058 for people like Dylan and Joan Baez. 350 00:22:20,093 --> 00:22:23,478 I came in to be in the middle of the energy. 351 00:22:23,513 --> 00:22:27,932 I went to New York City without a clue. 352 00:22:29,352 --> 00:22:31,436 There was so much happening in music. 353 00:22:31,438 --> 00:22:33,571 There was something so empowering 354 00:22:33,607 --> 00:22:38,076 about three chords and the music that you could make and the camaraderie. 355 00:22:42,666 --> 00:22:45,333 My parents, surprisingly, used to go down to the Village. 356 00:22:45,368 --> 00:22:48,419 So they would take me down there. 357 00:22:48,455 --> 00:22:50,755 There was a great, great music scene. 358 00:22:50,790 --> 00:22:52,757 But by the time I came up in the ranks, 359 00:22:52,792 --> 00:22:56,010 the scene changed. 360 00:23:02,185 --> 00:23:04,052 If you think about it, it was a throwback to the '50s 361 00:23:04,104 --> 00:23:06,888 when Little Richard and all those rock and roll groups, 362 00:23:06,940 --> 00:23:09,474 they would wear lavender suits and eye makeup. 363 00:23:09,526 --> 00:23:11,893 Music was getting too serious. 364 00:23:11,945 --> 00:23:13,561 So here were these young dudes coming up 365 00:23:13,613 --> 00:23:16,481 saying, "Damn it, people just wanted to have fun." 366 00:23:22,622 --> 00:23:24,989 Led Zeppelin was cool, but it was just like, 367 00:23:25,025 --> 00:23:28,126 "Well, I can't really be that 'cause that's superhero rock." 368 00:23:30,547 --> 00:23:34,716 So bands like KISS were really important to kids like me. 369 00:23:35,452 --> 00:23:38,436 We were the black sheep of the black sheep. 370 00:23:38,471 --> 00:23:41,422 We weren't cool. The cool guys were hanging out 371 00:23:41,474 --> 00:23:44,892 at Max's Kansas City and going out at night. 372 00:23:44,928 --> 00:23:49,480 They became the soundtrack to a fashion show. 373 00:23:49,516 --> 00:23:51,315 We were trying to kick ass 374 00:23:51,351 --> 00:23:53,351 and we kind of left them with their mouths open. 375 00:23:54,821 --> 00:23:57,855 It's not enough to read Rimbaud or Kerouac 376 00:23:57,907 --> 00:24:00,408 or hang out with Robert Mapplethorpe. 377 00:24:00,443 --> 00:24:03,194 That doesn't make you credible at rock and roll. 378 00:24:03,246 --> 00:24:05,530 Nor does makeup. 379 00:24:05,532 --> 00:24:08,700 It comes down to having the roots, 380 00:24:08,702 --> 00:24:12,170 really understanding rock and roll and preaching it. 381 00:24:15,542 --> 00:24:18,760 What was it like going out, seeing bands at the time? 382 00:24:18,795 --> 00:24:20,211 Like in the early '70s in New York? 383 00:24:20,263 --> 00:24:21,946 'Cause it sounds fucking crazy. 384 00:24:21,981 --> 00:24:23,047 It was CBGB's. 385 00:24:30,361 --> 00:24:33,191 I loved CBGB's. You know, it stands for 386 00:24:33,226 --> 00:24:34,926 country, bluegrass, and blues. 387 00:24:34,961 --> 00:24:38,813 But I don't remember a country artist being there ever. 388 00:24:38,865 --> 00:24:42,116 It was underground and it was undiscovered 389 00:24:42,152 --> 00:24:48,656 and it was a magnet for really eclectic people. 390 00:24:54,881 --> 00:24:58,750 I saw Allen Ginsberg and William Burroughs at CBGB. 391 00:24:58,752 --> 00:25:00,501 That's where all the energy was. 392 00:25:00,553 --> 00:25:02,503 And even all the visual artists in New York, 393 00:25:02,555 --> 00:25:03,971 that's where they would be. 394 00:25:04,007 --> 00:25:05,973 That's where Basquiat was. He was at CBGB. 395 00:25:06,009 --> 00:25:08,593 It was tight, sweaty, and dirty. 396 00:25:08,595 --> 00:25:12,230 It was what rock and roll clubs were supposed to be. 397 00:25:14,651 --> 00:25:17,769 Yeah, it was crazy. And, boy, that was a filthy freakin' bathroom. 398 00:25:17,821 --> 00:25:19,153 Man, oh, man. 399 00:25:19,189 --> 00:25:22,190 - I took a dump in there once. - Go, baby. 400 00:25:30,450 --> 00:25:34,335 I think it's no accident that punk rock 401 00:25:34,370 --> 00:25:37,789 had its birth and flowering in New York City. 402 00:25:37,841 --> 00:25:40,625 People were creating pretty raw, 403 00:25:40,627 --> 00:25:42,927 confrontational music 404 00:25:42,962 --> 00:25:46,430 because it was a raw, confrontational time. 405 00:25:59,696 --> 00:26:02,647 Bands like The Stooges and MC5 406 00:26:02,649 --> 00:26:04,982 that were sort of expressing that vibration 407 00:26:05,034 --> 00:26:07,318 from, like, this urban sort of nightmare zone, 408 00:26:07,370 --> 00:26:08,903 it was not popular at all. 409 00:26:08,955 --> 00:26:11,539 Joni Mitchell, Crosby, Stills, Nash & Young, 410 00:26:11,574 --> 00:26:14,125 James Taylor... All those album covers are on boats 411 00:26:14,160 --> 00:26:15,993 with dogs or, like, on porches 412 00:26:16,045 --> 00:26:19,797 and they're kind of rustic, smoking weed, being free. 413 00:26:19,833 --> 00:26:21,382 That was very hip. 414 00:26:21,417 --> 00:26:24,669 You know, the legend is 13 people bought the first Stooges album. 415 00:26:24,671 --> 00:26:26,337 They're the ones who became The Ramones. 416 00:26:37,851 --> 00:26:41,018 I'd been hearing about The Ramones, The Ramones, The Ramones. 417 00:26:41,020 --> 00:26:44,105 And my wife, she went down and saw them 418 00:26:44,157 --> 00:26:45,823 and came back raving. 419 00:26:45,859 --> 00:26:47,575 So the next day 420 00:26:47,610 --> 00:26:50,995 I rented a rehearsal studio and they came in. 421 00:26:51,030 --> 00:26:54,866 They must have played 15 or 18 songs 422 00:26:54,918 --> 00:26:57,702 in 15 minutes. 423 00:26:57,704 --> 00:27:01,839 And I said, "Stop. Let's do a deal." 424 00:27:08,431 --> 00:27:10,348 Seeing that cover of these guys 425 00:27:10,383 --> 00:27:12,884 on that cover against this brick wall in New York 426 00:27:12,936 --> 00:27:15,386 was really interesting to me 'cause the singer 427 00:27:15,388 --> 00:27:17,438 was as tall as I was. 428 00:27:17,523 --> 00:27:20,224 'Cause I'm tall. I'm like 6'6", 6'7", right? 429 00:27:20,226 --> 00:27:22,560 And nobody on stage was tall. These guys are all... 430 00:27:22,612 --> 00:27:24,946 It was Robert Plant, shirt off, big muscles 431 00:27:24,981 --> 00:27:26,447 and just singing, you know? 432 00:27:26,482 --> 00:27:28,149 Roger Daltrey, you know? 433 00:27:28,201 --> 00:27:32,119 There was nobody who was skinny and horrible-looking like I was. 434 00:27:32,155 --> 00:27:34,455 Except for this singer in this band The Ramones. 435 00:27:34,490 --> 00:27:36,874 I was like, "Who... What's that?" 436 00:27:36,910 --> 00:27:39,877 And I was so curious to hear what that sounded like. 437 00:27:45,051 --> 00:27:47,168 It just made me laugh uncontrollably. 438 00:27:47,220 --> 00:27:48,753 Just seemed like a joke 439 00:27:48,755 --> 00:27:51,422 because there was no point of reference for music that fast. 440 00:27:51,424 --> 00:27:54,976 But I did see The Ramones probably 50 times 441 00:27:55,011 --> 00:27:56,844 and they were my favorite group by far. 442 00:27:56,896 --> 00:27:58,930 If you've met all the Ramones, 443 00:27:58,982 --> 00:28:02,600 you know that The Ramones are bigger than the four members. 444 00:28:02,652 --> 00:28:04,568 Same is true with the Beatles. 445 00:28:04,604 --> 00:28:08,189 And they're amazing, incredibly talented, 446 00:28:08,241 --> 00:28:10,107 amazing, inventive people. 447 00:28:10,159 --> 00:28:12,777 The Beatles is a much bigger thing. 448 00:28:12,779 --> 00:28:14,862 The Ramones are a much bigger thing. 449 00:28:14,914 --> 00:28:16,948 It's not four people. 450 00:28:20,670 --> 00:28:24,455 All of a sudden, the energy of the urban was really cool. 451 00:28:24,507 --> 00:28:27,425 That was our thing. 452 00:28:27,460 --> 00:28:29,627 The hip-hop scene was more indicative 453 00:28:29,679 --> 00:28:33,014 of real New York because most people involved with New York hip-hop 454 00:28:33,049 --> 00:28:35,766 were people who grew up, were indigenous to New York City. 455 00:28:35,802 --> 00:28:38,052 Hip-hop started in New York. 456 00:28:47,146 --> 00:28:50,364 If people wasn't able to play these records in clubs, 457 00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:53,150 then they were gonna figure out how to play these records in the streets. 458 00:28:54,570 --> 00:28:55,987 You know, when Kool Herc came over here 459 00:28:56,039 --> 00:28:57,872 and just started jamming in the park, 460 00:28:57,907 --> 00:28:59,040 everything clicked. 461 00:29:01,995 --> 00:29:05,496 New York definitely influenced hip-hop in a huge way. 462 00:29:06,833 --> 00:29:09,667 The DJ, two turntables, a mixer, 463 00:29:09,719 --> 00:29:12,887 the crowd, every day was unexpected. 464 00:29:12,922 --> 00:29:15,006 It started in the Bronx, but everything 465 00:29:15,058 --> 00:29:17,391 is kind of tied together with transit systems. 466 00:29:18,978 --> 00:29:20,344 So whatever started in the Bronx, 467 00:29:20,396 --> 00:29:22,179 sure enough was going to be in Brooklyn, 468 00:29:22,181 --> 00:29:25,399 Queens, Long Island, Manhattan. 469 00:29:25,435 --> 00:29:29,020 The mecca of black life. 470 00:29:34,077 --> 00:29:36,827 We used to be running around doing handstands on the subway 471 00:29:36,863 --> 00:29:38,279 on our way to the studio. 472 00:29:38,331 --> 00:29:40,031 It was bananas. 473 00:29:40,083 --> 00:29:42,583 In the early days of hip-hop, 474 00:29:42,618 --> 00:29:45,002 all the artists felt like they shared a secret. 475 00:29:45,038 --> 00:29:48,589 We knew something there that people didn't know. 476 00:29:48,624 --> 00:29:51,842 We were punk rock kids and the second we heard hip-hop, that's for us. 477 00:29:56,382 --> 00:29:58,716 Hip-hop became the most important thing in my life. 478 00:29:58,768 --> 00:30:01,218 There was a tremendous, exciting 479 00:30:01,270 --> 00:30:02,887 revelation in this music. 480 00:30:02,939 --> 00:30:05,523 It's the same way that punk rock did it. 481 00:30:05,558 --> 00:30:08,526 Punk rock had Doc Martens, spiky hair. 482 00:30:08,561 --> 00:30:11,562 Hip-hop had sneakers and sheepskin coats. 483 00:30:11,614 --> 00:30:16,033 A different uniform, but the attitude was exactly the same. 484 00:30:16,069 --> 00:30:19,320 This kid we knew introduced us to Rick Rubin. 485 00:30:19,372 --> 00:30:21,655 He's got a PA, he's got turntables, 486 00:30:21,707 --> 00:30:23,908 and he's got a bubble machine. 487 00:30:23,960 --> 00:30:26,077 We're like, "We're in." 488 00:30:27,513 --> 00:30:29,280 I was working with the Beasties. 489 00:30:29,315 --> 00:30:31,749 Adam Horowitz would listen to all the demos that came in. 490 00:30:31,784 --> 00:30:34,118 One day he's like, "Rick, you should listen to this one. 491 00:30:34,153 --> 00:30:36,504 This kid is good." And it was LL Cool J. 492 00:30:42,261 --> 00:30:45,596 He was 16 and he had this encyclopedic knowledge. 493 00:30:50,686 --> 00:30:54,155 I made LL's first record, brought it to Russell. 494 00:30:54,190 --> 00:30:57,441 Through hearing that, we decided to start Def Jam basically. 495 00:30:57,493 --> 00:30:59,944 And LL was the only person to write lyrics 496 00:30:59,996 --> 00:31:02,863 for a Run DMC song other than Run DMC. 497 00:31:02,915 --> 00:31:04,498 That's how much they thought of him. 498 00:31:10,006 --> 00:31:13,124 They were the architects for what we wanted to do. 499 00:31:18,798 --> 00:31:20,798 Then the Beasties become, like, the biggest 500 00:31:20,850 --> 00:31:24,385 fucking band in the word. Did anyone see that coming? 501 00:31:24,437 --> 00:31:27,521 No. At no time did we think anything 502 00:31:27,557 --> 00:31:29,807 that we ever made would ever be heard by anyone. 503 00:31:29,859 --> 00:31:32,476 There was no point of reference. 504 00:31:32,528 --> 00:31:36,280 It wouldn't be realistic to ever expect that anybody would like it. 505 00:31:38,067 --> 00:31:42,069 Even people who liked it thought it wasn't music. 506 00:31:42,121 --> 00:31:45,990 And I felt like there's a way to illustrate 507 00:31:45,992 --> 00:31:49,293 that this is one thing. 508 00:31:55,801 --> 00:31:58,769 "Walk This Way" was the expansion of hip-hop 509 00:31:58,804 --> 00:32:00,171 into the mainstream world. 510 00:32:05,011 --> 00:32:07,728 - Rap seemed like it was kind of like... - It was a party. 511 00:32:07,763 --> 00:32:10,014 And then all of a sudden you have Public Enemy. 512 00:32:14,353 --> 00:32:16,987 One day we're hanging gig posters. 513 00:32:17,023 --> 00:32:18,772 We had taken the picture of Malcolm X 514 00:32:18,824 --> 00:32:21,659 when he was looking outside with the carbine rifle. 515 00:32:21,694 --> 00:32:23,994 This young guy comes by and says, 516 00:32:24,030 --> 00:32:25,529 "Oh, wow, you guys are getting down? Okay. 517 00:32:25,531 --> 00:32:27,865 Who's this Malcolm the tenth?" 518 00:32:33,756 --> 00:32:36,006 There was a certain militancy 519 00:32:36,042 --> 00:32:38,626 and I don't think think any hip-hop record 520 00:32:38,678 --> 00:32:40,544 before or after had that. 521 00:32:44,267 --> 00:32:45,933 The '60s. 522 00:32:45,968 --> 00:32:49,553 I remember clearly everything in my life from, 523 00:32:49,555 --> 00:32:53,107 you know, the murders and the assassinations, Vietnam War. 524 00:32:53,142 --> 00:32:56,060 I had uncles coming back, losing body parts. 525 00:32:56,112 --> 00:32:59,313 And, you know, this was the first 10 years of my life. 526 00:32:59,365 --> 00:33:04,235 Why wouldn't these things be commentary, like, 10 years later? 527 00:33:04,287 --> 00:33:07,571 We really were dealing with what we experienced 528 00:33:07,623 --> 00:33:10,074 and what we saw or we had heard, 529 00:33:10,126 --> 00:33:13,544 what we were taught, what we had learned. 530 00:33:13,579 --> 00:33:17,047 That's what made us say these kids need to know. 531 00:33:26,642 --> 00:33:28,809 The first time I came to New York City, 532 00:33:28,844 --> 00:33:32,263 I was maybe 11 or 12 years old. 533 00:33:34,984 --> 00:33:37,184 My mother, who was a public schoolteacher, 534 00:33:37,236 --> 00:33:38,819 saved up all her money 535 00:33:38,854 --> 00:33:42,773 so she could take my sister and I to New York for the weekend. 536 00:33:46,245 --> 00:33:48,829 We found the cheapest hotel room. 537 00:33:48,864 --> 00:33:50,364 We saw a Broadway play. 538 00:33:50,416 --> 00:33:52,616 We went to the top of the World Trade Center, 539 00:33:52,668 --> 00:33:54,752 the Empire State Building, 540 00:33:54,787 --> 00:33:57,838 the Statue of Liberty. Took the Staten Island Ferry. 541 00:33:57,873 --> 00:34:00,291 And pretty much every night 542 00:34:00,343 --> 00:34:02,509 I'd go to a hot dog cart 543 00:34:02,545 --> 00:34:05,212 and eat, like, seven hot dogs. 544 00:34:05,264 --> 00:34:08,132 And then I'd just go be ill in my hotel room. 545 00:34:10,436 --> 00:34:12,853 I could still remember it all very vividly. 546 00:34:12,888 --> 00:34:17,474 And I still love coming here. 547 00:34:27,236 --> 00:34:30,654 Yeah, I mean, I do want to talk about 9/11. 548 00:34:35,428 --> 00:34:38,996 You know, we're only about 12 or 13 blocks away. 549 00:34:40,132 --> 00:34:41,915 And I remember clearly coming here 550 00:34:41,967 --> 00:34:45,636 a couple of days after when they finally let you into the neighborhood 551 00:34:45,671 --> 00:34:47,971 that there was dust on the doorstep here. 552 00:34:54,680 --> 00:34:57,514 I mean, you could smell it, 553 00:34:57,566 --> 00:34:59,350 what had happened. 554 00:35:01,070 --> 00:35:03,520 Someone in the building here, 555 00:35:03,572 --> 00:35:07,358 Charles McCrann, was a really nice guy. He died that day. 556 00:35:07,410 --> 00:35:11,078 His son was actually interning for me. 557 00:35:17,336 --> 00:35:21,789 My son passed away earlier that year as well. 558 00:35:23,092 --> 00:35:25,376 It was a dark time. 559 00:35:34,804 --> 00:35:36,970 We actually talked about whether we would go on or not. 560 00:35:39,775 --> 00:35:42,943 Nobody wanted to come to New York. 561 00:35:42,978 --> 00:35:45,813 All the bookings that had been booked in advance 562 00:35:45,865 --> 00:35:48,565 completely dried up. 563 00:35:50,820 --> 00:35:53,904 So the business became completely local. 564 00:35:53,956 --> 00:35:56,990 The only people that came after 9/11 565 00:35:57,042 --> 00:35:58,959 were New Yorkers. 566 00:36:01,414 --> 00:36:04,298 I had to try to figure out a way to continue the studio. 567 00:36:07,887 --> 00:36:10,003 About six months after 9/11, 568 00:36:10,055 --> 00:36:14,591 I called Steve because I got a package in the office. 569 00:36:16,312 --> 00:36:19,847 And there was a little package about this big, square, 570 00:36:19,899 --> 00:36:24,568 brown paper, and twine tied around it. 571 00:36:24,603 --> 00:36:28,272 At that time, there were warnings all over the place, 572 00:36:28,274 --> 00:36:31,608 like, do not open unusual-looking packages 573 00:36:31,660 --> 00:36:33,110 with brown paper and twine 574 00:36:33,162 --> 00:36:37,197 because they could be bombs. 575 00:36:37,249 --> 00:36:41,201 I said, "Okay, I'm opening this and I'll go out with a blast, right?" 576 00:36:41,253 --> 00:36:45,839 And inside were four little boxes about that big 577 00:36:45,875 --> 00:36:50,177 of metal spool with wire. 578 00:36:51,797 --> 00:36:53,630 Was there a letter that came with this crazy package 579 00:36:53,632 --> 00:36:55,015 that explained what it was? 580 00:36:55,050 --> 00:36:57,301 Not really. It just said "Woody." 581 00:36:59,021 --> 00:37:02,139 Turns out it was the only performance of my dad live 582 00:37:02,191 --> 00:37:03,557 with an audience. 583 00:37:05,444 --> 00:37:08,979 A wire recorder is actually something that was only used 584 00:37:08,981 --> 00:37:12,783 for a year and a half in the '40s before they used tape. 585 00:37:24,163 --> 00:37:25,746 When I was a kid growing up, I was like, 586 00:37:25,798 --> 00:37:29,299 "Is it the songs? Is it what they stand for?" 587 00:37:29,335 --> 00:37:32,135 When I heard that wire recording, 588 00:37:32,171 --> 00:37:34,638 I went, "There it is." 589 00:37:36,642 --> 00:37:38,926 And that's 'cause of Steve. 590 00:37:40,312 --> 00:37:43,313 When my dad came to New York, it was 1940 591 00:37:43,349 --> 00:37:45,816 and he moved into a fleabag hotel 592 00:37:45,851 --> 00:37:47,951 on 43rd Street and 6th Avenue. 593 00:37:47,987 --> 00:37:52,022 Looking out the window, watching New Yorkers walk by, 594 00:37:52,074 --> 00:37:53,991 in the two weeks he was there, 595 00:37:54,026 --> 00:37:56,109 he wrote five of his greatest songs. 596 00:37:56,161 --> 00:37:58,412 The first one being "This Land is Your Land." 597 00:37:58,447 --> 00:38:00,197 Wow. 598 00:38:09,875 --> 00:38:11,758 He had just travelled across the country, 599 00:38:11,794 --> 00:38:15,379 so it was kind of a journal about what he'd been through. 600 00:38:17,182 --> 00:38:18,882 At the bottom of "This Land is Your Land," 601 00:38:18,934 --> 00:38:21,552 he wrote a little line, "All you can write is what you see." 602 00:38:34,066 --> 00:38:36,617 This is all connected. We were talking before. 603 00:38:36,652 --> 00:38:38,035 Everybody's connected. 604 00:38:49,415 --> 00:38:51,248 Write what you see. 605 00:38:51,250 --> 00:38:54,384 It's a different type of writing for me 606 00:38:54,420 --> 00:38:57,838 because I've always gone inward 607 00:38:57,890 --> 00:39:00,757 to discover things within myself. 608 00:39:00,759 --> 00:39:04,895 This time it's more like reporting. 609 00:39:06,649 --> 00:39:08,482 I love this. 610 00:39:08,517 --> 00:39:11,602 Someone asked me if any of these lyrics were personal 611 00:39:11,604 --> 00:39:15,022 because I was writing them about other people. 612 00:39:15,074 --> 00:39:18,325 And I said yes. Once you find that inspiration, 613 00:39:20,996 --> 00:39:23,614 you shouldn't be afraid to follow it 614 00:39:23,666 --> 00:39:26,083 because anything is possible. 615 00:39:29,455 --> 00:39:32,873 Wow. Wow. 616 00:39:32,925 --> 00:39:34,758 Fucking great. 617 00:39:34,793 --> 00:39:37,294 We decided not to do a lot of guitars on this one. 618 00:39:37,346 --> 00:39:39,379 Yeah. 619 00:39:40,766 --> 00:39:42,966 Think you could write some strings for it? 620 00:39:43,018 --> 00:39:45,435 Of course. I started writing them. 621 00:39:45,471 --> 00:39:47,437 Very nice. 622 00:39:47,473 --> 00:39:49,139 Wait, I'm done. Let's go in. 623 00:39:49,191 --> 00:39:51,692 When do we start? 624 00:39:53,312 --> 00:39:56,730 The making of music in this city is still kind of a business. 625 00:39:56,782 --> 00:40:00,233 And, you know, it goes against the trend now 626 00:40:00,285 --> 00:40:01,985 where musicians have their own home studios 627 00:40:01,987 --> 00:40:03,654 and they're working on laptops. 628 00:40:03,706 --> 00:40:06,123 So every time a studio folds, 629 00:40:06,158 --> 00:40:08,458 people cry, "Oh, I miss that place. 630 00:40:08,494 --> 00:40:10,711 I miss this studio. I miss that studio." 631 00:40:10,746 --> 00:40:12,829 Well, dude, you know, just close your laptop 632 00:40:12,881 --> 00:40:14,498 and support your local studio. 633 00:40:14,500 --> 00:40:16,917 You know? That's how you keep these places open. 634 00:40:16,969 --> 00:40:21,171 And the important part of this story is the mentorship 635 00:40:21,173 --> 00:40:24,091 and the fact of helping younger people. 636 00:40:24,143 --> 00:40:27,177 When I was a kid, I got a job at the Record Plant 637 00:40:27,179 --> 00:40:29,513 and this guy Roy Cicala was a teacher. 638 00:40:29,515 --> 00:40:33,016 That's what his thing was. And it was unbelievable. 639 00:40:33,018 --> 00:40:36,103 But that whole mentorship thing at recording studios 640 00:40:36,155 --> 00:40:37,521 is disintegrating quickly. 641 00:40:37,523 --> 00:40:40,357 So how do you see the future of this place? 642 00:40:41,361 --> 00:40:42,576 Future? 643 00:40:42,611 --> 00:40:44,861 Cloudy. 644 00:40:44,913 --> 00:40:48,165 People still need to play together. 645 00:40:48,200 --> 00:40:51,034 I guess. I hope. 646 00:40:51,086 --> 00:40:54,871 We'll see if recording studios last. 647 00:40:54,923 --> 00:40:59,459 We'll see if this is something that goes the way of the buggy. 648 00:41:00,846 --> 00:41:03,847 I feel like people like Steve Rosenthal 649 00:41:03,882 --> 00:41:05,849 are a dying breed. 650 00:41:05,884 --> 00:41:09,970 You could still walk down a New York City street, 651 00:41:10,022 --> 00:41:14,558 open a tiny little door and find someone like Steve Rosenthal. 652 00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:17,110 But if you're not careful, you'd never know. 653 00:41:17,146 --> 00:41:19,896 - For sure. - One of the dudes. One of the guys in a way. 654 00:41:19,948 --> 00:41:22,032 At least that's who... She just strikes... 655 00:41:22,067 --> 00:41:23,700 I don't know her that well, but... 656 00:41:23,736 --> 00:41:25,952 - Yeah, there's that. - Yeah. 657 00:41:28,957 --> 00:41:31,241 What's up, buddy? 658 00:41:31,243 --> 00:41:34,461 - How are you? I'm Dave. - Hey, Dave. 659 00:41:34,496 --> 00:41:36,079 - How you doing? - Good. 660 00:41:36,131 --> 00:41:38,965 - What's going on? - We're learning your songs on guitar. 661 00:41:39,001 --> 00:41:41,885 No way! They're really easy. 662 00:41:41,920 --> 00:41:43,754 Wow. 663 00:41:43,756 --> 00:41:45,839 He's written essays about you guys at school. 664 00:41:45,891 --> 00:41:49,476 Dude! You want to come in and see what it's like to make a Foo Fighters record? 665 00:41:49,511 --> 00:41:52,345 Come on in. Check it out. Come here. 666 00:41:52,397 --> 00:41:56,433 This is where everybody sits when we record. 667 00:41:56,435 --> 00:41:58,351 So that's the sound board. 668 00:41:58,403 --> 00:42:01,688 And so I'll sit here and play guitar. 669 00:42:01,740 --> 00:42:05,692 It's really loud and it's really fun. 670 00:42:05,744 --> 00:42:07,944 How long have you been playing guitar? 671 00:42:07,996 --> 00:42:10,580 Since third grade. 672 00:42:10,616 --> 00:42:12,532 What else do you play right now? 673 00:42:12,584 --> 00:42:16,119 Right now I'm playing "Bohemian Rhapsody" on guitar. 674 00:42:16,171 --> 00:42:19,256 Jeez Louise. Are you good? You're good. 675 00:42:19,291 --> 00:42:21,708 How many hours did you practice when you were a kid playing guitar? 676 00:42:21,760 --> 00:42:23,627 Well, I was obsessed with the guitar. 677 00:42:23,679 --> 00:42:27,013 And so I would come home from school and I would just sit there and play. 678 00:42:27,049 --> 00:42:29,516 Like until dinner. And then after dinner. 679 00:42:29,551 --> 00:42:31,635 - There you go. There you go. - And that was it. 680 00:42:31,687 --> 00:42:34,855 See, this whole rock and roll album thing 681 00:42:34,890 --> 00:42:37,641 isn't as glamorous as you'd imagine. 682 00:42:37,693 --> 00:42:41,611 So what would you like the legacy of this place to be? 683 00:42:41,647 --> 00:42:44,481 I want people to think that it was a... 684 00:42:44,533 --> 00:42:47,734 A place that they could be comfortable in, 685 00:42:47,786 --> 00:42:49,903 that worked well, 686 00:42:49,955 --> 00:42:54,708 and that things happened musically 687 00:42:54,743 --> 00:42:55,992 that couldn't have happened anywhere else. 688 00:42:55,994 --> 00:42:59,913 And a-one, and a-two, and a-three. 689 00:43:00,883 --> 00:43:01,998 Got it. 690 00:43:02,050 --> 00:43:03,416 - Thank you so much. - Bye, guys. 691 00:43:03,468 --> 00:43:06,136 I'm just gonna keep going until... 692 00:43:06,171 --> 00:43:09,673 I get kicked out, I guess. 693 00:43:16,348 --> 00:43:19,649 New York is very different than the New York I grew up in. 694 00:43:19,685 --> 00:43:21,184 I guess that's true of everywhere, though. 695 00:43:21,236 --> 00:43:24,354 It's just the mom-and-pop nature of it has gone away. 696 00:43:26,191 --> 00:43:29,025 I'm all for making the city better, 697 00:43:29,027 --> 00:43:31,411 making it cleaner, making it safer. 698 00:43:31,446 --> 00:43:36,166 There is a character to it that's just gone. 699 00:43:45,210 --> 00:43:47,677 My wife and I helped transform this neighborhood. 700 00:43:47,713 --> 00:43:50,430 And now it's completely yuppified. 701 00:43:50,465 --> 00:43:53,683 And what they want to do is put condos and corporate-controlled stores 702 00:43:53,719 --> 00:43:55,936 and kick out all the mom-and-pop stores. 703 00:43:55,971 --> 00:43:58,855 And they don't want any music. 704 00:43:58,891 --> 00:44:01,975 You would think there would be some sort of a government agency 705 00:44:02,027 --> 00:44:03,443 which would say, "You know what? 706 00:44:03,478 --> 00:44:06,780 Instead of destroying the reason why people 707 00:44:06,815 --> 00:44:09,065 want to come to this neighborhood in the first place, 708 00:44:09,117 --> 00:44:11,451 why don't I help support the culture?" 709 00:44:13,405 --> 00:44:15,789 It pisses me off when I go to the bank. 710 00:44:15,824 --> 00:44:18,241 So I've owned this place for 25 years. 711 00:44:18,293 --> 00:44:20,827 Is that meaningful? No. 712 00:44:20,879 --> 00:44:24,464 All that's meaningful is what happened in the last 60 days. 713 00:44:24,499 --> 00:44:26,416 People's lives, 714 00:44:26,468 --> 00:44:30,420 it's the qualitative total of their life, 715 00:44:30,472 --> 00:44:32,389 of what they've done in their life 716 00:44:32,424 --> 00:44:34,975 that should have some meaning. 717 00:44:35,010 --> 00:44:37,344 You know what's weird? It used to. 718 00:44:38,480 --> 00:44:40,847 New York City is gonna end up a place 719 00:44:40,899 --> 00:44:43,733 with condos, co-ops and corporations. 720 00:44:43,769 --> 00:44:47,604 And no reason for people to come here anymore. 721 00:44:54,079 --> 00:44:56,947 So that's what'll happen to the studio, I assume. 722 00:44:56,949 --> 00:44:59,449 Unless I figure out... 723 00:44:59,451 --> 00:45:02,285 Figure out some crazy way around it. 724 00:45:03,622 --> 00:45:05,538 I don't know, Dave. 725 00:45:05,590 --> 00:45:08,124 I was feeling good, but now I'm getting depressed. 726 00:45:13,265 --> 00:45:16,132 Steve was one of my first interviews. 727 00:45:16,134 --> 00:45:20,804 That conversation grew into something so much bigger. 728 00:45:20,806 --> 00:45:23,440 Rather than talk about the color of the knobs 729 00:45:23,475 --> 00:45:25,809 on his really awesome Neve board, 730 00:45:25,861 --> 00:45:28,862 we wound up talking about America 731 00:45:28,897 --> 00:45:31,698 and how we used to take care of each other. 732 00:45:34,987 --> 00:45:38,455 I looked at my interview with Steve 733 00:45:38,490 --> 00:45:43,326 like the message of this entire project. 734 00:45:43,328 --> 00:45:46,830 We're all connected by something. 735 00:45:48,050 --> 00:45:50,083 Maybe it's a river that runs underground. 736 00:45:50,135 --> 00:45:52,335 Maybe it's Woody Guthrie. 737 00:45:52,387 --> 00:45:55,388 Maybe it's Chuck D. Whatever. 738 00:45:55,424 --> 00:45:59,642 That conversation became my goal. 739 00:46:01,346 --> 00:46:02,846 I want to talk about these people. 740 00:46:02,848 --> 00:46:04,681 I want to talk about music. 741 00:46:04,733 --> 00:46:07,684 But I want to get to this. 742 00:46:07,686 --> 00:46:11,488 I want this to be the exclamation point. 743 00:46:16,862 --> 00:46:18,912 Music is life. 744 00:46:18,947 --> 00:46:22,365 I don't think your life is remotely complete 745 00:46:22,417 --> 00:46:25,285 without music of some kind in it. 746 00:46:25,337 --> 00:46:28,371 Innately, we all know what we're capable of doing. 747 00:46:28,373 --> 00:46:31,591 And then somebody comes along and tells us it's impossible. 748 00:46:31,626 --> 00:46:35,045 The person who always tells you that something's impossible is the one who failed. 749 00:46:35,097 --> 00:46:38,214 It's like, yo, man, keep your attention 750 00:46:38,250 --> 00:46:41,351 on being able to get out of yourself 751 00:46:41,386 --> 00:46:43,386 with that art underneath your arms 752 00:46:43,388 --> 00:46:45,605 and you go rushing into the end zone. 753 00:46:46,892 --> 00:46:48,808 Do what you feel like doing. 754 00:46:48,860 --> 00:46:50,477 Sometimes it's gonna work, sometimes it's not. 755 00:46:50,529 --> 00:46:53,113 Those are the moments when you just got to stay true to you. 756 00:46:53,148 --> 00:46:55,231 It's all about the truth, right? 757 00:46:55,233 --> 00:46:57,700 Like, trying to get to the truth through your guitar 758 00:46:57,736 --> 00:46:59,903 or your drums or whatever it is. 759 00:46:59,905 --> 00:47:03,239 Know your history. Just listen. 760 00:47:03,241 --> 00:47:05,575 Listen to the early stuff. The early blues. 761 00:47:05,627 --> 00:47:07,460 The early rock. 762 00:47:09,131 --> 00:47:13,633 It's important to chase what catches your fancy, 763 00:47:13,668 --> 00:47:18,555 but above all, learn to play what you want to hear. 764 00:47:18,590 --> 00:47:21,508 What's happening in New York now? 765 00:47:23,645 --> 00:47:25,512 If you want to find out what's going on in the city, 766 00:47:25,564 --> 00:47:27,597 what you want to do is talk to a 44-year-old 767 00:47:27,599 --> 00:47:30,066 who stays home most of the time. 768 00:47:30,102 --> 00:47:31,968 Finger on the pulse. 769 00:47:33,805 --> 00:47:36,206 Hopefully there's a room full of people who think what I did is stupid, 770 00:47:36,241 --> 00:47:38,675 making awesome shit and high-fiving each other. 771 00:47:38,710 --> 00:47:41,244 Have fun. 772 00:47:41,279 --> 00:47:43,496 If you're lucky enough to be talented, 773 00:47:43,532 --> 00:47:47,167 that's a blessing and you almost owe it to the creator 774 00:47:47,202 --> 00:47:49,002 or whatever the powers that be are 775 00:47:49,037 --> 00:47:51,871 to have fun with it. That's your job. 776 00:47:53,341 --> 00:47:55,758 Don't fall for the idea of purist 777 00:47:55,794 --> 00:47:58,461 that everything has to be analog or everything has to be electronic 778 00:47:58,463 --> 00:48:00,346 or everything has to be anything. 779 00:48:00,382 --> 00:48:01,931 Have a field day with it 780 00:48:01,967 --> 00:48:05,518 'cause there's so many awesome things you could do. 781 00:48:05,554 --> 00:48:07,687 It's a burning coal. 782 00:48:07,722 --> 00:48:11,107 It's not cold. You know, it's hot stuff. 783 00:48:11,143 --> 00:48:14,394 You want to start a fire? I got the coal. 784 00:48:14,446 --> 00:48:17,530 That's what history is to me. 785 00:48:17,566 --> 00:48:21,651 And it attracts the right person to do something with it. 786 00:48:21,703 --> 00:48:23,486 To create the next fire. 787 00:48:23,538 --> 00:48:28,124 And fires are fuel and food and energy and life. 788 00:48:29,494 --> 00:48:31,661 I remember being in the White House once 789 00:48:31,713 --> 00:48:33,713 for a performance in the East Room. 790 00:48:33,748 --> 00:48:38,334 And on a break I went downstairs into the small library. 791 00:48:38,336 --> 00:48:41,804 The first book that caught my eye 792 00:48:41,840 --> 00:48:44,224 was a book of Bob Dylan lyrics. 793 00:48:44,259 --> 00:48:46,259 And in that moment, 794 00:48:46,311 --> 00:48:51,347 I realized that every American has the opportunity, 795 00:48:51,399 --> 00:48:54,517 that every American has a voice. 796 00:48:54,519 --> 00:48:57,487 I'm sure Bob Dylan never imagined 797 00:48:57,522 --> 00:49:01,441 that a book of his lyrics would be in the library 798 00:49:01,493 --> 00:49:05,578 of the White House for any president to walk downstairs and read 799 00:49:05,614 --> 00:49:12,202 and maybe inspire a president to change the world. 800 00:49:12,254 --> 00:49:15,171 He was a huge musical influence to me. 801 00:49:15,207 --> 00:49:18,007 He was somebody who reminded me 802 00:49:18,043 --> 00:49:22,428 of how powerful the American story can be told through music. 803 00:49:22,464 --> 00:49:25,765 Part of the American music tradition 804 00:49:25,800 --> 00:49:30,053 is not just being a consumer of music, it's being a producer of music. 805 00:49:30,105 --> 00:49:32,472 How do you inspire that next generation 806 00:49:32,524 --> 00:49:34,440 to go out and do that? 807 00:49:34,476 --> 00:49:38,144 You know, my sense is that the creativity 808 00:49:38,196 --> 00:49:42,198 that this culture produces, it's inexhaustible. 809 00:49:42,234 --> 00:49:43,783 It's just going to keep on going. 810 00:49:43,818 --> 00:49:46,202 So we want our kids to make sure 811 00:49:46,238 --> 00:49:48,705 that they're part of that communal process. 812 00:49:48,740 --> 00:49:53,076 'Cause it's all about the garage band. 813 00:49:53,128 --> 00:49:55,878 It's about the juke joint... 814 00:49:56,831 --> 00:49:58,748 The jazz club. 815 00:49:58,800 --> 00:50:02,835 It's about people rejecting what is already there 816 00:50:02,887 --> 00:50:05,838 to try to create something entirely new. 817 00:50:05,890 --> 00:50:09,392 To me, the beautiful thing about our country 818 00:50:09,427 --> 00:50:13,346 is that you can be Buddy Guy 819 00:50:13,398 --> 00:50:15,598 and make your instrument from a piece of your screen porch 820 00:50:15,600 --> 00:50:18,067 and wind up in the Kennedy Center. 821 00:50:18,103 --> 00:50:21,104 Or be a kid from Springfield, Virginia, 822 00:50:21,106 --> 00:50:22,939 and then get into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. 823 00:50:22,991 --> 00:50:27,026 Or be a kid from Hawaii who becomes the president. 824 00:50:27,078 --> 00:50:29,028 - You know what I mean? - Absolutely. 825 00:50:29,874 --> 00:50:31,748 And that's always been a theme 826 00:50:31,783 --> 00:50:34,388 in American popular music and rock and roll. 827 00:50:34,411 --> 00:50:36,786 You got a dream and you take a chance 828 00:50:36,788 --> 00:50:38,705 and you make it. 829 00:50:38,757 --> 00:50:43,893 And all you got is your wits or an idea. 830 00:50:45,897 --> 00:50:47,730 You know, kids are always gonna come up with something 831 00:50:47,782 --> 00:50:49,882 that you haven't heard before. 832 00:50:49,934 --> 00:50:55,638 What's also nice, though, is how there is a connection. 833 00:50:55,690 --> 00:50:59,609 All these different musical rivers that run together 834 00:50:59,644 --> 00:51:02,143 to make American music. 835 00:51:02,168 --> 00:51:05,253 There's nothing more unifying in this country 836 00:51:06,640 --> 00:51:08,530 than our music. 837 00:51:16,552 --> 00:51:19,912 _ 838 00:52:49,858 --> 00:52:52,744 _ 839 00:52:52,778 --> 00:52:55,747 _ 840 00:52:55,781 --> 00:52:59,667 _ 841 00:53:01,870 --> 00:53:04,706 _ 842 00:53:04,708 --> 00:53:07,842 _ 843 00:53:07,876 --> 00:53:11,713 _ 844 00:53:13,799 --> 00:53:16,384 _ 845 00:53:16,435 --> 00:53:18,970 _ 846 00:53:19,021 --> 00:53:23,474 _ 847 00:53:26,228 --> 00:53:29,297 _ 848 00:53:31,617 --> 00:53:34,035 _ 849 00:53:34,069 --> 00:53:37,205 _ 850 00:53:37,239 --> 00:53:40,958 _ 851 00:53:43,212 --> 00:53:46,047 _ 852 00:53:46,081 --> 00:53:48,750 _ 853 00:53:48,801 --> 00:53:52,804 _ 854 00:53:54,890 --> 00:53:57,692 _ 855 00:53:57,726 --> 00:54:00,745 _ 856 00:54:00,779 --> 00:54:04,716 _ 857 00:54:07,102 --> 00:54:10,822 _ 858 00:54:12,775 --> 00:54:17,245 _ 859 00:54:17,279 --> 00:54:19,947 _ 860 00:54:19,949 --> 00:54:22,834 _ 861 00:54:22,868 --> 00:54:28,005 _ 862 00:54:28,757 --> 00:54:31,709 _ 863 00:54:31,760 --> 00:54:35,129 _ 864 00:54:36,131 --> 00:54:39,550 _ 865 00:54:41,720 --> 00:54:46,557 _ 866 00:54:48,777 --> 00:54:53,981 _ 867 00:54:53,983 --> 00:54:58,703 _ 868 00:55:00,205 --> 00:55:05,493 _ 869 00:55:05,495 --> 00:55:09,580 _ 870 00:55:12,050 --> 00:55:17,138 _ 871 00:55:17,172 --> 00:55:21,843 _ 872 00:55:23,729 --> 00:55:28,683 _ 873 00:55:28,685 --> 00:55:32,487 _ 874 00:55:56,762 --> 00:56:00,515 _ 875 00:56:02,718 --> 00:56:07,221 _ 876 00:56:09,942 --> 00:56:14,896 _ 877 00:56:14,898 --> 00:56:18,699 _ 878 00:56:21,153 --> 00:56:26,541 _ 879 00:56:26,575 --> 00:56:30,328 _ 880 00:56:32,764 --> 00:56:38,085 _ 881 00:56:38,120 --> 00:56:42,924 _ 882 00:56:44,476 --> 00:56:49,564 _ 883 00:56:49,598 --> 00:56:53,818 _ 884 00:57:18,594 --> 00:57:23,130 _ 885 00:57:24,900 --> 00:57:30,271 _ 886 00:57:30,305 --> 00:57:34,041 _ 887 00:57:36,478 --> 00:57:41,699 _ 888 00:57:41,733 --> 00:57:46,571 _ 889 00:57:48,123 --> 00:57:53,210 _ 890 00:57:53,245 --> 00:57:57,431 _ 891 00:58:28,130 --> 00:58:30,364 Sync, corrected by icephoenix www.addic7ed.com